Heartland Corridor Opens Soon

[billworsham]

NS is set to run the first stack train through the Heartland Corridor September 9th or thereabout.  Go here to see the latest three videos...

http://www.youtube.com/user/norfolksoutherncorp#p/a

My guess is the Central Division will lose at least two trains:  22A and 236.

[Ns Railfan]

The central div should only loose 236 since it is a Chicago to Norfolk Va and 23G and 22A are Louisville to Norfolk.

[steveiez]

Will all kinds of freight move on this new route? How much fewer trains will Pittsburgh see?

[Fly Device]

I'm sure many folks would appreciate inside updates on exactly when the first new/rerouted trains will break the tape, in addition to any clearance runs prior to that. The video descriptions say it opens Sept 9 but one imagines that will be subject to change as the date nears. Who can resist the opportunity for a "historic" shot of the first stack train at a particular location.

[JCagle]

It will be more than one train. The entire project is designed to streamline routing to major ports and other terminals. Tunnel clearance heights versus capacity was a major factor in this project.

[NS212]

Pittsburgh Division should only lose a couple of trains. 227/228 are the only ones I can think of.

[Fly Device]

Pittsburgh Division should only lose a couple of trains. 227/228 are the only ones I can think of.

It's possible that a lot of existing trains will remain but might get their route shortened and/or see reduced loadings as the HC double stacks pick up the through containers between Chicago and the Norfolk/Charlotte region. They might or might not be assigned different symbols when that happens.

You probably wouldn't lose 228 since it's only Harrisburg to Norfolk and the HC isn't exactly the shortest route. If 228 is carrying any containers from Detroit via 20V bound for Norfolk, those might move onto a HC train. 227 would probably stay as well but the Harrisburg-Cleveland-Detroit leg might get split into another train since the through containers from Norfolk would likely to go via a HC train as well.

The intermodals currently running the HC route are 217/218 serving Charlotte/Greensboro - Chicago and 233/234 serving Norfolk - Chicago. Presumably they will become double stacks.

22A is presently Norfolk to Louisville but with containers bound for Cincinnati, St Louis, Kansas City, Chicago via other trains. It seems unlikely this train would go away or get rerouted since the HC isn't en route from Norfolk to Louisville (unless they go on the HC to Portsmouth and from there to Cincinnati via the Cincinnati District ... not sure it can handle stacks). Any through containers from Norfolk to Chicago might already be on the 233.

236 is Chicago, Cincinnati, Georgetown KY, Norfolk with payload bound for Savannah, Charleston and Charlotte via other trains. Currently stacks routed via Bristol. Through containers from Chicago to Norfolk could go on a HC train if they're not already, but they could keep this symbol to serve either half of this route.

23G is Louisville to Norfolk, also currently stacks routed via Bristol. Like 236, the HC is not en route. It's possible that this train could just take on the Norfolk-bound containers from 236 that originate in Cincinnati/Georgetown and keep the same route. That would let 236 or equivalent shorten up to just Chicago - Cincinnati/Georgetown.

From what I can tell, those should be the only trains directly impacted but it's hard to say what the indirect effect might be on other routes. No doubt they have a sophisticated process for optimizing container routing and train allocation.

[Fly Device]

Pittsburgh Division should only lose a couple of trains. 227/228 are the only ones I can think of.

Also, forgetting the routing changes for existing NS traffic, the big idea was obviously that the capacity improvement would result in a lowering of NS's costs and rates such that they gain loadings currently carried by other railroads, truck, and ship via the Panama Canal. Costs would be reduced primarily on the HC route but secondarily on the bypass routes which are offloaded by the improved HC capacity. Many of these could function as the eastern leg of a trans-con route. So it's possible the container count will go up on the HC without decreasing on non-HC through routes.

[NS212]

Pittsburgh Division should only lose a couple of trains. 227/228 are the only ones I can think of.

It's possible that a lot of existing trains will remain but might get their route shortened and/or see reduced loadings as the HC double stacks pick up the through containers between Chicago and the Norfolk/Charlotte region. They might or might not be assigned different symbols when that happens.

You probably wouldn't lose 228 since it's only Harrisburg to Norfolk and the HC isn't exactly the shortest route. If 228 is carrying any containers from Detroit via 20V bound for Norfolk, those might move onto a HC train. 227 would probably stay as well but the Harrisburg-Cleveland-Detroit leg might get split into another train since the through containers from Norfolk would likely to go via a HC train as well.

The intermodals currently running the HC route are 217/218 serving Charlotte/Greensboro - Chicago and 233/234 serving Norfolk - Chicago. Presumably they will become double stacks.

22A is presently Norfolk to Louisville but with containers bound for Cincinnati, St Louis, Kansas City, Chicago via other trains. It seems unlikely this train would go away or get rerouted since the HC isn't en route from Norfolk to Louisville (unless they go on the HC to Portsmouth and from there to Cincinnati via the Cincinnati District ... not sure it can handle stacks). Any through containers from Norfolk to Chicago might already be on the 233.

236 is Chicago, Cincinnati, Georgetown KY, Norfolk with payload bound for Savannah, Charleston and Charlotte via other trains. Currently stacks routed via Bristol. Through containers from Chicago to Norfolk could go on a HC train if they're not already, but they could keep this symbol to serve either half of this route.

23G is Louisville to Norfolk, also currently stacks routed via Bristol. Like 236, the HC is not en route. It's possible that this train could just take on the Norfolk-bound containers from 236 that originate in Cincinnati/Georgetown and keep the same route. That would let 236 or equivalent shorten up to just Chicago - Cincinnati/Georgetown.

From what I can tell, those should be the only trains directly impacted but it's hard to say what the indirect effect might be on other routes. No doubt they have a sophisticated process for optimizing container routing and train allocation.

I was never sure, but I always had a feeling 228 was only running out of Harrisburg. Is that the same for 227? Someone in Ohio said they haven't heard those trains between Toledo-Detroit in quite sometime. My father is an engineer, currently working a Conductor job, in which he regularly runs on 227/228 to and from Hagerstown, MD. I'll have to ask him about it.

[nspitltrainlogger]

As far as I understand 227 still runs on the Pittsburgh Line.  In fact, as I type, an extra or late 227 (I27) just called the MO signals on the West Slope feed.  I have 227 being a Norfolk-Detroit train, with 228 being a Harrisburg-Norfolk train.  You'd think they'd be re-routed, but if so, what takes over as the train that works the Virginia Inland Port?

[Conrail Tweety]

Also, forgetting the routing changes for existing NS traffic, the big idea was obviously that the capacity improvement would result in a lowering of NS's costs and rates such that they gain loadings currently carried by other railroads, truck, and ship via the Panama Canal. Costs would be reduced primarily on the HC route but secondarily on the bypass routes which are offloaded by the improved HC capacity. Many of these could function as the eastern leg of a trans-con route. So it's possible the container count will go up on the HC without decreasing on non-HC through routes.

That sounds good in theory, but all the work to my knowledge went to the N&W route, mostly west of Bluefield. Nothing went into the VGN side between Narrows and Roanoke. All non-intermodal loads go over the VGN East of Narrows and if they are going to be putting additional LOADS eastbound, some capacity improvements I would think are needed on that side, there is not a ton of sidings and in a lot of cases no room for any additional track, like between Celco and McCoy where it hugs the river.

There were HC improvements east of Bluefield in the Virginia Division, on the N&W (Christiansburg District) side of New River, including the longest tunnel to get a raised roof. Most intermodal and manifest trains run both directions on that side already. There is no immediate need to improve the VGN (Whitethorne District).

If you think of the Whitethorne and Christiansburg districts as running parallel between Narrows and Roanoke, then in effect it is mostly triple-track territory already, with the exception of Walton to Cowan, Belspring to Pembroke, and Potts Valley Junction to Pearisburg.

The bridge over the river between Norcross and Potts Valley Junction can be used to bypass the area between PVJct and Pearisburg as long as no local train is working between Celco and Norcross. Cars exceeding Plate F can run the portions of the Whitethorne District west of Norcross and east of Bradshaw.

The slow heavy eastbound coal and grain loads normally run eastbound from Narrows on the VGN. As long as they keep about one-hour spacing between them, there won't be any delays at Whitethorne. Lighter trains that don't need a push can run at shorter intervals. Most other traffic eastbound from Narrows runs on the Christiansburg District already.

Some reasons for routing the heavy eastbound trains on the VGN from Narrows include:

1)   The VGN is mostly single-track east of Narrows, and is mostly dedicated to eastbound traffic.

2)   The eastbound climb from the New River Valley is only half as steep on the VGN as the N&W, needing fewer motors.

3)   The summit beyond the climb on the VGN is at a lower elevation than the N&W, requiring less fuel to cross the Allegheny Mountain range.

4)   Only two pusher motors are needed from Whitethorne as opposed to three from Cowan.

5)   It's much easier to keep the higher priority trains moving in both directions on the N&W when there are fewer heavy (slow) eastbounds in the mix.

6)   Westbound empty hopper trains can pull the N&W grade into Christiansburg pulling 180 cars behind only two motors, and they will only meet eastbound coal where there is double-track mainline.

Dennis

[Conrail Tweety]

Will all kinds of freight move on this new route? How much fewer trains will Pittsburgh see?

It's not a new route. The route has already been in use for all kinds of trains except double-stacked containers. Overhead clearances have been increased to allow double-stacks to run a more direct path across West Virginia between Norfolk and Columbus/Chicago instead of their current routing via Tennessee or Pennsylvania.

The previous intermodal trains were limited to Trailer-on-Flatcar (TOFC), Container-on-Flatcar (COFC), and single-stack well cars.

The new path will double the intermodal cargo capacity per train, and reduce travel time to and from Norfolk by about 16 hours, making it a more attractive alternative to trucking.

Dennis

[steveiez]

Thanks Dennis for filling me in. I wasn't familiar with that route. I looked at the map discovering that back in my tucking days I hauled a load from Norfolk to Peebles Ohio. Rt US 460 followed a lot of the rail route. I remember it has being foggy and narrow!

[NS212]

As far as I understand 227 still runs on the Pittsburgh Line.  In fact, as I type, an extra or late 227 (I27) just called the MO signals on the West Slope feed.  I have 227 being a Norfolk-Detroit train, with 228 being a Harrisburg-Norfolk train.  You'd think they'd be re-routed, but if so, what takes over as the train that works the Virginia Inland Port?

Well, since 228 is a Harrisburg-Norfolk train, there would be no reason for his train to be moved to the Heartland. Also, if they did move them to the Heartland, I think they would bring back trains 24Q/25Q to serve the VIP.

[rrman70]

Another change is 217/218 are to start running double stacks sometime next month. The trains are to be rerouted from the Piedmont/Virgina division Hurt connection to Lynchburg Va. and run the Virginia Division Blue Ridge line into Roanoke. There are four tunnels on the V-line from Hurt to Roanoke that will not clear loaded double stack cars. They have already adjusted 217's schedule to leave Linwood and Greensboro 1 hour earlier.

[tq-07fan]

It's possible that a lot of existing trains will remain but might get their route shortened and/or see reduced loadings as the HC double stacks pick up the through containers between Chicago and the Norfolk/Charlotte region. They might or might not be assigned different symbols when that happens.

The intermodals currently running the HC route are 217/218 serving Charlotte/Greensboro - Chicago and 233/234 serving Norfolk - Chicago. Presumably they will become double stacks.

22A is presently Norfolk to Louisville but with containers bound for Cincinnati, St Louis, Kansas City, Chicago via other trains. It seems unlikely this train would go away or get rerouted since the HC isn't en route from Norfolk to Louisville (unless they go on the HC to Portsmouth and from there to Cincinnati via the Cincinnati District ... not sure it can handle stacks). Any through containers from Norfolk to Chicago might already be on the 233.

236 is Chicago, Cincinnati, Georgetown KY, Norfolk with payload bound for Savannah, Charleston and Charlotte via other trains. Currently stacks routed via Bristol. Through containers from Chicago to Norfolk could go on a HC train if they're not already, but they could keep this symbol to serve either half of this route.

The east end of former N&W Cincinnati District from Cincinnati to Portsmouth is out of service of course. We have been searching for the truth but it sounds like a lot of work is needed on the approach to the Scioto River bridge just west Vera (connection with Columbus Dist). This lies in a flood plain and gets annual flooding. The trestle it'self may not clear double stacks and there may be a low overpass. There is a plan to correct the few clearance restrictions on the Dayton Dist (former Conrail Cincinnati Line). This line would allow for container work in Columbus routing them from Cincinnati through Dayton to the Heartland Corridor that way. The railroad was built and rebuilt for higher speeds and doesn't have the grades of the Cincinnati District. On the plus side even when it was operating the Cincinnati District didn't have that much traffic or Dayton or Columbus to slow intermodal trains. 217 and 218 used to run this way and boy do I miss seeing them out there.

Going to catch 234 as a single stack for almost the last time tomorrow (Friday 27).

Jim